Mischa (saarloos?) DK

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Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Nino » Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:22 pm

In the thought that there might be someone out there willing to help this beautiful girl I thought I should post her.
http://oasa-dk.dk/?Site=413213

Mischa
Mischa is a very rare breed, which there is only about 30 of in Denmark. She is a Saarloos Wolfhound around 7-9 months of age, which came into the vet to be euthanized after she was found by the police. Atm. she is around 55-60 cm heigh and weighs 23 kg (right now she is a little skinny).

She is a special dog, or rather wolf, cause there is 90% wolf in her (Okay I admit I don't know much about the Saarloos, but 90% isn't that a little high set? I thought it was around 15% :shock: ). Therefore she have to go to a home where there is other dogs, no children, noise and lots of guests, cause she will be very nervous.
She is always very loving and faithful, but in her "wolfmind" there is a nervousness which means she is always wary.

Mischa is in a foster family in Herning (DK), she is chipped, vaccinated, sterilized and healthinspected.

Price:
6000 DKK all of which will go to help other animals in need.

Contact
Chairman Mirja Holm Thomsen
Phone: +45 26 20 67 10 (monday - thursday fra kl. 11-12)
Email: mirja@oasa-dk.dk
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Blustag » Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:26 pm

Poor baby I hope she gets a lovely home that she deserves. :D

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Taz » Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:39 pm

Poor girl, hope she gets anew home soon. She is definitely going to need an understanding owner.

Btw, I believe saarloos have around 40% wolf blood in them. Csv's have less, around 25% ish.

Certainly nowhere near 90%, perhaps you could contact them and let them know of their over estomation. Saying she has that much wolf in her, may put people off taking her on.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Katlin » Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:17 pm

:( poor little lady, hope she finds a loving home!
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by HiTenshi16 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:43 pm

Poor girl, she is lovely. I hope she gets her forever home soon.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Nino » Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:53 pm

She is actually lucky.. at first she was supposed to be put to sleep, but someone took her in foster
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by JulieSmith » Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:55 pm

She looks a lovely dog for anyone wanting a Saarloos and still young enough to get over what ever has happened to her so far with the right help. I am so glad the vet did not put her down that would have been such a shame. I hope she finds the right forever home soon.

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by TParham86 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:50 pm

She's very pretty. It good that she's in a foster home but I hope she finds a forever home soon :P

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:51 pm

She looks very nice, I'm glad that she's been given a second chance and hope she finds her Forever Home soon!
Her behavior sounds very typical for a Saarloos and they certainly aren't 90% wolf - the timidity just comes with the breed.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by wicca1 » Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:11 pm

hope she finds a forever home soon.

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Valravn » Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:37 am

90%!?! Not even close.

Lovely girl. I hope she gets an owner knowledgable about the breed.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Gaby » Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:55 am

Ahh, she looks like Mila! I hope she finds a home soon, the poor thing!

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Blustag » Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:02 pm

Taz wrote:Btw, I believe saarloos have around 40% wolf blood in them. Csv's have less, around 25% ish..
Now this all depends on where you get them from. There are unscrupulous breeders that have reintroduced wolf or wolfdogs in the last years, but these are few and far between. Like with a lot of so called 'wolfdog' owners people like to exagerate and say their dogs have wolf content even when they dont. Trust me on that!

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by TerriHolt » Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:32 pm

i hope she find an understanding home. lucky to be spared her life :P
Blustag wrote:
Taz wrote:Btw, I believe saarloos have around 40% wolf blood in them. Csv's have less, around 25% ish..
Now this all depends on where you get them from. There are unscrupulous breeders that have reintroduced wolf or wolfdogs in the last years, but these are few and far between. Like with a lot of so called 'wolfdog' owners people like to exagerate and say their dogs have wolf content even when they dont. Trust me on that!
sad but true (i saw someone walking a husky once and after engaging in conversation about how adorable he looked, he told me i'd never see it again because it's a wolf)...

i just don't think they should add wolf to dog and they should leave the wolf where it belongs in all it's glory, not been treat like a dog (not that there's anything wrong with that for domestic dogs). humans have to mess with everything, (ligers, horse x zebra etc). there has to be a stopping point or we'll end up with ducks with paws and lizzards with wings or something stupid like that...

imagine living as a Saarloos or Wolfdog, timidity will always be there, you will always be living scared of everything but bacause you are 'owned', you have to face the things you are scared of every single day of your life... i'd say wolf dogs should be banned no matter the % but people will always find a way to get one :( sad way to live tho... especially if they end up like this girl, lot of them won't be so lucky.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Taz » Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:57 pm

Blustag wrote:
Taz wrote:Btw, I believe saarloos have around 40% wolf blood in them. Csv's have less, around 25% ish..
Now this all depends on where you get them from. There are unscrupulous breeders that have reintroduced wolf or wolfdogs in the last years, but these are few and far between. Like with a lot of so called 'wolfdog' owners people like to exagerate and say their dogs have wolf content even when they dont. Trust me on that!
Trust me when I say I know exactly what you mean.

I've come across a few people who are convinced their dog/s are wolf crosses. There is one person in paticular on another forum I post on, their dogs are lovely, but the one they claim is an F5 just looks like a collie x sib.

You may know of whom I speak, they had a utonagan, but now claim he was an F4. according to them, the breeder apparently kept 2 pure wolves in a barn and also owned a wolf x mastiff.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Misaya » Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:35 pm

She is very pretty but doesn't look to me like a pure Sarloos. I hope she finds a loving and understanding home soon poor girl.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by MoirAran » Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:20 pm

Not a pure Saarloos to me. And not the description of a Saarloos too :roll: Sad to see some reactions here posted :cry: . A Saarloos can be timide or whatever, but the Saarloos is a balanced dog. It also not have 40 % wolf in it. A Saarloos is extremley great with kids, so loving, not living his whole life in fear.

Do not understand the "bad" reputation of the wolfdog. A Saarloos is a wolfDOG, just a dog, that's all ;) Maybe because of the bad breeders outhere, that are mixing Saarloos and Czech with whatever breed.

So when you're in Holland, please come visit my house to meet my 3 wolfdogs :D
Greetings, Kristel
Aran & Moira & Rayne

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by TerriHolt » Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:47 pm

MoirAran wrote:Not a pure Saarloos to me. And not the description of a Saarloos too :roll: Sad to see some reactions here posted :cry: . A Saarloos can be timide or whatever, but the Saarloos is a balanced dog. It also not have 40 % wolf in it. A Saarloos is extremley great with kids, so loving, not living his whole life in fear.

Do not understand the "bad" reputation of the wolfdog. A Saarloos is a wolfDOG, just a dog, that's all ;) Maybe because of the bad breeders outhere, that are mixing Saarloos and Czech with whatever breed.

So when you're in Holland, please come visit my house to meet my 3 wolfdogs :D
nothing against wolfDOG's just WOLFdog's... man have messed with so many things... i just hate to see it happen to the wolf. beautiful WILD animals and should stay that way... nothing a human can do, no matter how loving can compare with their natural home. this is why i love tams... my wolf without the wolf (dispite what some think ;) )and without the guilt for containing/caging a wolf and robing him/her of his home, natural environment.
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One is Evil. It’s anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by swake » Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:50 am

Has anyone else notices that poor girls front right leg. There something wrong with it
LuLu has been missing for about 6 months. lost in my area and it hits close to home, though animals have been found across the world. So if you have seen this dog please let one of these people know
http://www.facebook.com/HelpFindLulu

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Taz » Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:48 am

Perhaps Saarloos in Holland are bred with a more sound temperament in mind. I hope so, I find it sad that people in any breed would want to actively breed and produce nervous dogs. Aloof is one thing, nervous is quite another.

However, speaking to owners outside of Holland, nervous, or with a tendancy towards nervousness, is how the breed are described.

40% ish is also the most common estomated wolf % for a saarloos I've come across. What is the actual approximate % if that is wrong?
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by MoirAran » Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:01 pm

Well, both the Saarloos as the Czech are based on the "same" origine. In case of the Saarloos based on the German Shepherd and the Europian Wolf. The Czech based on the german Shepherd and the Karpatian Wolf. So I do not understand the wide range of wolf % in both breeds ;)

And totally do not understand why is spoken of wolf% in both breeds, because they are both dogs. No one I 've met here in Holland speaks of wolf% in their Saarloos, even not so in Belgium or Germany or France. Same for Czech owners. Why would owners do that? Because they are just dogs. An official recognized dog breed by FCI, just like the Czech.
The Saarloos is a Dutch breed.

I do not know a breeder and owner, who would refer to the Saarloos as a nervous breed. Because they are not supposed to be nervous.

Sad that in other countries, this breed does not have the good reputation as here in the land of origine. Saarloos make very good family pets (we have 4 childern :D )

Edit:
The founder of the breed, Leendert Saarloos, wanted to create a dog, that would be good as a helping dog for blind people. Recently, his daughter wants to know if those abilities are still in the breed. So already several owners have spent the weekend at her home and training together with the dog. Several dogs have passed the training, so luckely not a nevouw breed ;)
Greetings, Kristel
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Nino » Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:08 pm

Well since I do not know much about the Saarloos I cannot comment on other than I believe that it is very unlikely that a Saarloos were found wandering around in Denmark, since it is a VERY rare breed and I have never met one or heard of anyone i know meeting one in person (though I have met the first breeder of the czech - which dosen't breed anymore).

The reason I came acroos Mischa was because I was searching a danish dog forum (hundegalleri) for the word Tamaskan - in case there were anything interesting (most were myself mentioning the breed though lol) - and that thread came up because the dog was found and someone asked if it could be a Tamaskan (NO!) ..
I postet it in here because I know there are several in here with experiance of the breed, that might know more than I, and who might even know someone in Denmark (or maybe Germany or Norway) that wanted a dog like this.. :)
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Taz » Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:32 pm

MoirAran wrote:Well, both the Saarloos as the Czech are based on the "same" origine. In case of the Saarloos based on the German Shepherd and the Europian Wolf. The Czech based on the german Shepherd and the Karpatian Wolf. So I do not understand the wide range of wolf % in both breeds ;)
I've always got the impression that the Saarloos had more wolf in the gene pool due to either more wolves being used in the original breeding program and or, because after Saarloos died the 'undesirable' wolf trates weren't so actively selected against.

I've also heard that North American subspecies were unofficialy added in, along with some Northern breed dogs.

I'm not stating the above as fact, its just what I've come across.
And totally do not understand why is spoken of wolf% in both breeds, because they are both dogs. No one I 've met here in Holland speaks of wolf% in their Saarloos, even not so in Belgium or Germany or France. Same for Czech owners. Why would owners do that? Because they are just dogs. An official recognized dog breed by FCI, just like the Czech.
The Saarloos is a Dutch breed.
I agree, both the Saarloos and Csv are dog breeds and should be viewed as such. I mentioned the 40% wolf content earlier because:

1. Its what I'd been told by 'some' saarloos people.

2. To emphasize that 90% was far to high. Not because I view the Sarloos or Csv for that matter as wolf hybrids, because I don't.
I do not know a breeder and owner, who would refer to the Saarloos as a nervous breed. Because they are not supposed to be nervous.
Unfortunately, that's how they are seen here and apparently in other countries as well. I've noticed a few Csv owners elsewhere refer to shy Csv's as having Saarloos temperaments or being like Saarloos. Obviously, those people haven't had good experiences with your breed either, or have been informed by those who haven't.

There are very few pure Saarloos in the UK and there is doubt over the purity of those. They were imported from a less than reputable French kennel, the man who imported them described them as being at various stages of feral. One escaped and gave birth in the woodland on his proppety, another had to be shot as she became so agressive. The escaped dog was rehomed and was doing well last time I heard from the owner.

The original importer crossbred them but stopped breeding altogether as to many of the dogs were being returned to him, as owners couldn't cope. The only other person breeding 'pure' Saarloos has also stopped because of their temperament apparently. They still breed mixes, something I don't agree with just to make that absolutely clear.
Sad that in other countries, this breed does not have the good reputation as here in the land of origine. Saarloos make very good family pets (we have 4 childern :D )
Agree it is very sad. It is said that Saarloos are great with their owners, just nervous/shy of new people or environments for the most part.
Edit:
The founder of the breed, Leendert Saarloos, wanted to create a dog, that would be good as a helping dog for blind people. Recently, his daughter wants to know if those abilities are still in the breed. So already several owners have spent the weekend at her home and training together with the dog. Several dogs have passed the training, so luckely not a nevouw breed ;)
I heard about Saarloos's original attempts to train his dogs as guide dogs.

Do you have anymore detailed information as to what training and under what conditions, the training was/is being carried out by his daughter. I've a particular interest in this area.

Sounds promicing however, there's a great deal of difference between working with a familiar person/s in a restricted area, to working with someone relatively or completely (to begin with) unfamiliar in real life situations that aren't controled, as I'm sure you are aware.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Blustag » Sun Aug 14, 2011 1:55 pm

{Taz quote} Do you have anymore detailed information as to what training and under what conditions, the training was/is being carried out by his daughter. I've a particular interest in this area.

If I remember correctly his daughter was thrown out of the Saarloos club and joined up with the 'French' Breeder whose name I shant mention here for obvious reasons. There was/is a lot of crossbreeding going on at that particular kennels last I heard. I must mention that I visited this kennels in France and was appalled at the conditions and state of the dogs. All but one could not be handled and were in fact quite feral. I think there were about 25 or 30 dogs there at the time along with 2 or 3 litters of puppies. It was from these kennels that the first bitch was imported into the UK in whelp. I met this bitch and her temperament was awful both over in France and also when I saw her in the UK in her new home. I would have loved to have imported both the Saarloos and the Czech Wolfdog into the UK to breed PURE....as my interest is not only in the breeds themselves but also in showing, but I am so glad that I didnt now because I would have had nightmares selling the puppies as the people interested in these breeds are mosly undesirables and that worried me greatly.

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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by MoirAran » Sun Aug 14, 2011 2:08 pm

There are some videoclips about the training. I will look them up.

Almost everyone was thrown out of the first Saarloos Club :? The daughter isn't connected to the French breeder for quite some long time.

There ar enot that many breeders, so why not import from Holland ;) You can not compare the french breeder to any breeder in Holland. And the Saarloos is a dog who always wants to be with his family. So without humane contact, you get a completely other dog :evil: Altho I know some very sweet and gentle Saarloos and also Czechs from this French breeder, very gorgeous too
Greetings, Kristel
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Czertice » Fri Aug 19, 2011 11:05 am

Does anyone know if this Saarloos bitch still searches for a home? To me she looks very much like a Saarloos.

My CSW has 27% of wolf blood, according to a pretty reliable statistic tool, you can see the details here>
http://www.amicale-chien-loup-tchecoslo ... g_id=11867
We can have these statistics, because the experiment has been very well documented since the very beginning.

From what I have seen and heard about Saarlooses, they are more shy and wolfish in behavior than CSWs. An experienced breeder of both breeds have written a very interesting article comparing both breeds. It is in Czech, but maybe you can try using google translate> http://www.wolfdogs.cz/index.php/o-sav/ ... saarloosuv
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Nino » Fri Aug 19, 2011 11:13 am

Czertice wrote:Does anyone know if this Saarloos bitch still searches for a home? To me she looks very much like a Saarloos.
She is still up on the site (which of cause isn't always a 100% though)
If you are or know someone that are interested you could write them (or PM me if that's "easier")
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Czertice » Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:02 pm

Nino wrote:
Czertice wrote:Does anyone know if this Saarloos bitch still searches for a home? To me she looks very much like a Saarloos.
She is still up on the site (which of cause isn't always a 100% though)
If you are or know someone that are interested you could write them (or PM me if that's "easier")
I thought that I might put up a notice about her on Raksha's site, to help her at least a little.
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Re: Mischa (saarloos?) DK

Post by Nino » Fri Aug 19, 2011 3:14 pm

Czertice wrote:
Nino wrote:
Czertice wrote:Does anyone know if this Saarloos bitch still searches for a home? To me she looks very much like a Saarloos.
She is still up on the site (which of cause isn't always a 100% though)
If you are or know someone that are interested you could write them (or PM me if that's "easier")
I thought that I might put up a notice about her on Raksha's site, to help her at least a little.
Id couldn't hurt
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