Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

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Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Tarheel » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:12 am

Here is the latest addition to the Aatu Outcrosses;
This a Quote from Ta-kari Tamaskans:
INTRODUCING: ALASKAN NOBLE COMPANION DOG "IOWA":
In the early 1990's, Ann Dresselhaus, creator of the Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD), began this breed from purebreds and mixes that she chose for foundation stock. A geneticist and well-respected canine enthusiast and breeder, Dresselhaus is extremely knowledgeable in a variety of areas, including the true creation of a new breed. She has been willing to share that knowledge with us so that we are better informed and experienced in our pursuits for the Aatu.

With a better understanding of our dogs’ pedigrees and a clear vision of the ideal Aatu, we are very excited about introducing this breed and what it will add towards the achievement of the ideal Aatu Tamaskan breed standard."
http://www.takari-tamaskans.com/id77.html

Seems to be a lot of these solo breeder Breeds popping up. :roll:
Add the Alaskan Noble Companion Dog to this growing list as well.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

Post by sky » Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:50 am

Just to clarify because you may not know, the Noble has been a breed in progress since 1991. That's 20 years. I and the founder would hardly say that it's something that has just popped up! IMO, I even think that surpasses the Tam, but I could be wrong. Although you could argue that the original dogs that Eddie used to start the ball rolling date back to the 80's. If it was late 80's, then close to the same time, again IMO.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

Post by Tarheel » Sat Feb 26, 2011 3:34 am

I apologize for my lack of knowledge of the Alaskan Noble Companion dog. Through my research, I could only find one breeder on the Internet "Noble Paws". I wrote the breeder and never got a reply. I was curious if this was a wolfdog breed or a wolf look a like. I searched the Internet for information on the breed Founder "Ann Dresselhaus". Again, There was very little information about her and the development of this breed.

When I heard that an Aatu Tamaskan Breeder had obtained one of these dogs to use as an outcross I was curious of the history of the breed. My research lead me to the OFA website for tested Nobles, for a breed that has been around since the early 90's I expected to see many more dogs in the data base. If you have information about the breed, please send me an Email or a PM , I would love to hear from you.

Are you a breeder of the Noble's? What is your experience with the Noble Dog? I have only seen pictures.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

Post by blufawn » Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:32 am

I had also never heard of the Alaskan Noble breed until recently.
I have never seen one nor come across them on the internet, are they only in America?
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

Post by Nino » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:03 am

Tarheel wrote:I apologize for my lack of knowledge of the Alaskan Noble Companion dog. Through my research, I could only find one breeder on the Internet "Noble Paws". I wrote the breeder and never got a reply. I was curious if this was a wolfdog breed or a wolf look a like. I searched the Internet for information on the breed Founder "Ann Dresselhaus". Again, There was very little information about her and the development of this breed.

When I heard that an Aatu Tamaskan Breeder had obtained one of these dogs to use as an outcross I was curious of the history of the breed. My research lead me to the OFA website for tested Nobles, for a breed that has been around since the early 90's I expected to see many more dogs in the data base. If you have information about the breed, please send me an Email or a PM , I would love to hear from you.

Are you a breeder of the Noble's? What is your experience with the Noble Dog? I have only seen pictures.
Would think its a wolfdog

Noble grey girl Phoenix 3-3 1/2mnths
"(she kept calling her a wolf when she is NOT a wolf...and she is not near pure either, I told her several times to not lie about that she was and is not licensed for such and I don't sell wolves to the public!) "

http://www.noblepawz.com/noblepupsspring08.htm
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:22 pm

Nino wrote:Would think its a wolfdog
Looking at those pictures, they are definitely wolfdogs; there is NO WAY IN HELL that anyone will convince me otherwise, it is very obvious. They're certainly mid/upper content... several generations of selective breeding would make them more "domesticated" and tame, but the genetics still provides notable characteristics. Actually, reading through the write-ups of each pup, it sounds like many of them have still retained wolf-like behavioral traits...
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by HiTenshi16 » Sun Feb 27, 2011 3:03 pm

Was not the "No Wolf Tamaskan Fable" all about false advertising as the Tamaskan not having wolf and not really to bash on the breed? Even IF Saarloos Wolfdog or Czeslovakian Wolfdog were used, those are now considered just dogs (no recent wolf ancestry unless there are some illegitimate breeders still adding in wolf) since they have been breeds for a long time so therefore their argument is invalid. Most of the other stuff on that site is all "he said, she said" kind of stuff and I know just how wrong those can be from my own experience with family (us living over here in Texas and the rest of my family in Florida with my older sister who has a grudge against my mother). What I am trying to get at though is I believe their thought process is that since there "is" wolf in the Tamaskan and they are letting people know this, that it is now okay to use mid/upper content wolfdogs to get a more wolfy look for their Aatus. But from looking on one of their sites when it was available to the public, the "Alaskan Noble Companion Dog" that was being used as a stud did not look as majestic (or wolfy) as the ones I'm seeing on Noble Pawz. If I remember correctly from what I read, I believe it said that the stud she is using is not to be confused with the ones from Noble Pawz as she got hers from a different breeder and that this same breeder does not have any wolf in her dogs but did sell one of her dogs to Noble Pawz.
Please correct me if I am wrong on any of this.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Sun Feb 27, 2011 3:58 pm

HiTenshi16 wrote:Was not the "No Wolf Tamaskan Fable" all about false advertising?
They do make it sound like that is what they are trying to do, but the point is that they are not telling the truth. There are things (not everything) written on that website about us that are 100% NOT true and the only way they could have come up with them is if they 'made them up' out of their own head. Lies have nothing to do with false advertising and has everything to do with breed (or person) bashing...

You can no more trust their website than you can Kevin/Ronnie's Tamaskan Truth because they are biased and they report information the way they want everyone to see it, not the way it really is (aka lies or bending the truth) and like Kevin/Ronnie they are also hypocrites. I recently had an email from one of Kim's customers... seems that although she told them the pup had a chance of monorchidism she failed to point out that its great-grandmother had died of epilepsy and that its grandparent on mums side and all of mums siblings that have been tested failed their hips, meaning that Kim's litter all had a chance (however slight) of being a) monorchid b) epileptic and c) having hip dysplasia and yes this was Kim's first litter and she knew about all of the above. And so the coin is flipped, how can you trust someone who herself tells lies and hides the truth?

Personally I would never believe anything I read on the internet about anyone until I saw the proof myself and, like Debby said, even then that does not mean it is 100% true, just look at the "newspaper articles" on Kevin's site....

Our dogs do not look like F1 or F2 wolfdogs, if we were producing these high content litters you would see at least one or two pups looking like 'proper' wolves.
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:21 pm

Sylvaen wrote:Hmmm, I'm not sure as the page is no longer publicly accessible (along with many other pages on that website) - so much for the, what was it? "openness and honesty"? lol I can't find any other info about the "breed" anywhere on the internet aside from on the Noble Pawz website... but I do have a contact who has been friends with Ann Dresselhaus for many years so I'll discuss it with him and see what he has to say. :)
I've also been looking for any information about the 'Alaskan Noble Companion Dog' but there's almost none to be found..

This is from NoblePawz:
The Alaskan Noble Companion Dog: From the breed founder Ann Dresselhaus, "The Alaskan Noble Companion Dog's development began in the early 1990's (est.1991) The goal for this breed in progress is to produce a dog that will exceed the Siberian Husky, Alaskan Husky, Alaskan Malamute, German Shepherd, and Belgian Shepherd dog breeds in 'wolfy looks" yet will be tractable, biddable, a house companion, and capable of many kids of work.

About NoblePawz: Our Dogs are a rare breed in progress "The North American Noble Dog" these dogs are wolf like due to their heritage and careful selective breeding. Thus retain a highly wolfie appearance. Our dogs lineage go back to some of the oldest and most verifiable lines, they have several different breeds of dog within their making, the breed itself getting it's start in 1991. I talk about content levels and other important aspects on this site not to attached such to my own dogs , but due to so much ignorance revolving around such canines, and such vast experience. Our dogs bred for companions, are just that, DOGS NOT WOLVES Pure wolves are illegal for any of the public to own without licensing.

So Basicly the Alaskan Noble Companian Dog doesn't have any wolf in it but NoblePawz has been using some of these dogs and mixed them in with Wolf Hybrids to create there own 'The North American Noble Dog'. It's strange though that you can't really find anything about the breed or any breeders? If the Alaskan Noble Companion Dog really doesn't have wolf content but does havethe wolfy looks it might be interested for the Tamaskan breed to maybe add one as an outcross?

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:32 pm

Its strange though, when we first started the Tamaskan breed we searched high and low for similar breeding programs across the world, we looked everywhere for wolfy looking dogs without wolf content, that is what led us to Finland but during all my talks with breeders and scouring of the internet I NEVER came across either of these breeds. Does make me wonder if they are not 'exaggerating' a tad with their est1991 ??? But because I have never heard of them I cant say, perhaps they have just not been 'online' until now!?!?
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
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Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Tarheel » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:03 pm

I found this intersting article from the Breed founder "Ann Dresselhaus". What makes this interesting is the Alaskan Noble companion dog is billed as having no wolf content, but the article gives you a different perspective of the mindset of the author.
When Does a Wolf Become a Dog?
or
Are AKC German Shepherds Wolf 'Hybrids' /Wolfdogs ?

by Ann Dresselhaus


I assert that ALL dogs are 'wolfdogs'. The only difference between them (besides
appearance and temperament) is the number of generations away from a 'pure'
wolf the individual canine is. The original German Shepherd studbook,
Zuchtbuch fur Deutche Schaferhunde (SZ), shows several pure wolves were
used to 'create' the breed and this was only 90 years ago! Similar events
can be uncovered for Alaskan Malamutes, Siberian Huskies, Belgian Shepherd
types, and many rarer-breed 'dogs'. German Shepherds were recently the
MOST POPULAR AKC breed. Imagine that -- a 'wolfdog' is the most popular
working/companion dog!

I think a key question to be answered is: WHEN does a 'wolf become a dog??
There is more to the article,but the introductory paragraph says it all. If someone can all dogs are wolfdogs, how can they breed something that is not?
Here is a link to the full article.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/88218/th ... ome+a+Dog-
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Lyss » Mon Feb 28, 2011 12:07 am

From BuckhornTamaskan.com: (hope it's okay I post this?)
The ANCD is also a new breed in progress. The founder, a geneticist, beginning in 1991, has created a black phase "wolf look-a-like" composed of herding, northern, retriever, sheep guarding, and sighthound breeds. Specifically the following breakdown:

Herding Group: White German Shepherd, Border Collie

Northern Working Group: Malamute, White Siberian Husky

Retrieving Group: Black Lab

Sheep Guarding Group: Great Pyrenees

Sighthound Group: Greyhound

The founder of this "noble breed" only sells by personal recommendation and has no web site to reference. Do not confuse the Alaskan Noble with The North American Noble Dog bred by Noblepawz. They are not one in the same.
There's also this video:



Thats about as much as I could find on the web.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:33 am

It's always interesting to see info about the ANCDs. That video is new! Xena is a gorgeous girl. I find it very strange that she is being advertised for movies/TV because I was in contact with Ann before and she clearly stated that she didn't support using ANCDs or any other dog dogs as "wolves" in film as it misrepresented wolves.
But I really love the look of her dogs!

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by kendrrat » Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:40 am

i dunno but this all sounds like theyre operating in a big grey area of "well theres only a pinch of wolf or wolf was pretty far back so i can call them dogs now right?" i mean i understand that the article was bringing up that interesting point of where is the line drawn between dog and wolf (or at least hybrid/wolf content)? so maybe theyre using that to call their dogs "dogs" when they might possibly have some wolf content? i mean does it say anywhere specifically something like "there is no wolf content in these dogs"? in the quote from noblepaws it sounds like they are purposefully avoiding that. i dont know... just a thought. :ugeek:

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Tarheel » Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:06 am

Kootenaywolf wrote:I find it very strange that she is being advertised for movies/TV because I was in contact with Ann before and she clearly stated that she didn't support using ANCDs or any other dog dogs as "wolves" in film as it misrepresented wolves.
I noticed both Noble Pawz and Ann advertize their dogs for use in TV and Movies now.

Kootenaywolf, since you have been in contact with Ann Dresselhaus in the past, maybe you can ask her to clarify the mystery behind her breed in progress and what standard the ANCD is to be bred to. Surely a breed in progress since 1991 should have a standard by now. Also, maybe you could find out about the article about "all dogs are wolfdogs" and if/why it is claimed that the ANCD contains no recent wolf content?
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:24 am

Ann does state that there is no wolf content in her dogs. Noblepawz on the other hand is open about the fact that there is wolf in her dogs - she started with Wicca an ANCD and then she bred her to I believe a pure wolf, and then I think bred Amnesty (from that cross), back to pure wolf again.
There is a breed standard for the ANCD - http://alaskannoblecd.weebly.com/breed-standard.html

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Lyss » Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:34 am

Also! I stumbled upon the ANCD Arrow (who sadly passed away in... 2006 I think), who was an ambassador at Wild Spirit Wolf Sanctuary. BUT he wasn't presented as a wolf - he was actually teaching people how difficult it is to tell the difference between a wolf and a dog. From the Wild Wolf Sanctuary blog:
Also, we unfortunately lost a more distant relative of the family -- an animal who's life was able to educate and inspire many, while acting as an ambassador. One of our dear friends, Dick Thayer, a board member, volunteer, and family member, recently lost his partner, Arrow, an Alaskan Noble Companion Dog who represented the availability of wolfy-looking animals with a disposition taht could be matched by no other. With the assistance of Dick, Arrow was able to teach many people about how difficult it can be to tell the difference between a wolf and a dog, as well as inspire many potential wolf-dog owners, to find in his breed an equally beautiful animal, wth a personality that belongs in a home. We lost Arrow while he was at work, and while his death greatly pains us all, we feel honored to be blessed by his presence, and that he respectfully passed while doing what he did best --educating & inspiring the public. Our prayers are all with Dick, and we know that his strength and Arrow's lingering love and spirit will pull him through as well.
Here's a picture of him on Wild Wolf Sanctuary's photostream.

Anyway, just thought I'd share, because apparently the 'Sanctuary believes the ANCD is a dog ;)
Enough to advise people interested in owning a wolfy looking dog to search for alternatives like the Alaskan Noble.

(by the way, thank you for the standard Kootenaywolf!)

EDITED TO ADD:
Kootenaywolf wrote:Xena is a gorgeous girl. I find it very strange that she is being advertised for movies/TV because I was in contact with Ann before and she clearly stated that she didn't support using ANCDs or any other dog dogs as "wolves" in film as it misrepresented wolves.
Xena is very pretty :) And this was in the description of the video:
Xena desires actress/actor positions that require a high level of command/response training depicting wolf-like canines.

Will only play 'good-guy wolves' thereby keeping moral integrity intact. [emphasis added]

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:51 am

Thanks for the info everyone, I find it very interesting. :) The dogs presented look really gorgeous, I would love to have a black phase wolfy looking dog!

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by kendrrat » Mon Feb 28, 2011 10:37 am

yes, theres no doubt about it, they are truly beautiful! :D

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by HiTenshi16 » Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:43 pm

The ANCD is also a new breed in progress. The founder, a geneticist, beginning in 1991, has created a black phase "wolf look-a-like" composed of herding, northern, retriever, sheep guarding, and sighthound breeds. Specifically the following breakdown:

Herding Group: White German Shepherd, Border Collie

Northern Working Group: Malamute, White Siberian Husky

Retrieving Group: Black Lab

Sheep Guarding Group: Great Pyrenees

Sighthound Group: Greyhound

The founder of this "noble breed" only sells by personal recommendation and has no web site to reference. Do not confuse the Alaskan Noble with The North American Noble Dog bred by Noblepawz. They are not one in the same.
Am I the only one to find it strange that they are getting a black phase wolf-look alike with this group of dogs, especially the White German Shepherd, White Siberian Husky, and Great Pyrenees?
Image

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:20 pm

I find the whole list strange.. Why have those kind of dogs been used? They differ alot from eachother, most of these don't look wolfy at all.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Sylvaen » Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:40 pm

HiTenshi16 wrote:Am I the only one to find it strange that they are getting a black phase wolf-look alike with this group of dogs, especially the White German Shepherd, White Siberian Husky, and Great Pyrenees?
Nope... I'm thinking along the same lines. That's why I question the claim that there truly is no recent wolf content. With those breeds, you wouldn't get black phase coats and I don't think the pups would "breed true" because you'd get all kinds of colors / body types popping up. I'd be curious to see photos of the dogs that went into her breeding program, much like how the "Tamaskan Ancestry" photo album is on public display. This breed seems to be very limited on info (photos / bloodline data / etc). Also, for a breed that's been in development since 1991, I'm surprised to see only 9 dogs listed in the OFA database. (In comparison there's ~24 Tamaskan Dogs listed in the OFA database in the past couple of years.) And I can't find any info about any of those dogs, anywhere online, apart from:

"AMNESTY PEACE SONG"
http://www.offa.org/display.html?appnum=1349430

Image
I cannot say enough good about this dog!!! Every single one of the pups turned out to be the same sweet, gentle giant Amnesty is. Amnesty is foundation stock for a rare breed called the Alaskan Noble Companion Dog. Amnesty is very social and meets NO strangers , he is VERY SWEET! and will fall onto his back in ecstacy if he is even touched. This boy is a huge lover baby, and my pride and joy. He is an extremely healthy dog and LOVES his bye byes. He is off lead trained and housetrained. He also gets along great with all other dogs including small breeds! Amnesty is a black phase with very pale lemon yellow/bordering on pale green eyes in person. http://www.noblepawz.com/nobleadults.htm
EDIT: just found Apollo (the sire of Iowa, who is to be used in the Aatu Bloodlines) - he looks like a White Swiss Shepherd... with snow nose? I can already foresee some "interesting" colors popping up in future Aatu generations.

Image

"Apollo"Alaskan Noble Companion Dog with Weave Poles
Owner: Ann Dresselhaus of Cedar Rapids, IA

And a discussion from another forum:
Though you may not be an active proponent of wolfdog crosses the woman you quote (Ann Dresselhaus) is.

A three minute Google search shows all of the myriad boards and organizations that she is actively associated with.

The Wolfdog's Resource: http://www.idir.net/~wolf2dog/index.html#Articles

http://www.shilohshepherds.info/101Wolfdogs.htm

She has some very interesting opinions on this forum aimed at advocating wolf crosses: http://www.network54.com/Forum/17027/

Her wolfdog temperament test is referenced by this wolfdog breeder: http://www.cottonwoodz.com/

She's also quoted on this website called Wolfdog training: http://www.fiu.edu/~milesk/training.htm
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_ ... ml?pagen=8
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:39 pm

Amnesty is not an ANCD - he is Skylar of noblepawz's spin off of the breed. She bred her ANCD to pure wolf, and Amnesty is one of those puppies. I'm npt sure why she says he is foundation stock for the ANCD. He is foundation stock for her breed type, North American Noble Dog.
I have definitely heard from Skylar that there was wolf in the ANCD to begin with though - who knows. I kind of feel like, regardless of whether there was or not, she has managed to produce really wolfy looking dogs that are highly trainable.
She competes successfully in herding trails, and all of Ann's breeding dogs need to get as many titles on them as possible before being accepted into the breeding program - obedience, agility, herding and also therapy. So, regardless of whether there was wolf in there, the dogs are obviously not your average wolfdog.
Anyway I find the breed pretty interesting!

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:52 pm

Kootenaywolf wrote: She competes successfully in herding trails, and all of Ann's breeding dogs need to get as many titles on them as possible before being accepted into the breeding program - obedience, agility, herding and also therapy. So, regardless of whether there was wolf in there, the dogs are obviously not your average wolfdog.
That sounds really interesting...... But then wolves are highly intelligent, more so than domestic dogs and there is no denying they are high/mid content.
But its nice to see that she goes through such lengths when choosing breeding stock, she obviously has a goal and is breeding for intelligence, I admire that. :)
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Blustag » Mon Feb 28, 2011 6:46 pm

Whatever is in these dogs they are very handsome ;)

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:55 pm

blufawn wrote: That sounds really interesting...... But then wolves are highly intelligent, more so than domestic dogs and there is no denying they are high/mid content.
But its nice to see that she goes through such lengths when choosing breeding stock, she obviously has a goal and is breeding for intelligence, I admire that. :)
I agree wolves are more intelligent than dogs, however usually they don't get to a high level of obedience training - and definitely not herding!
She definitely does have a goal though, every one of her breeding dogs has to have a CGC by 4-6 months of age as well.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:57 pm

How could we know if a wolf could herd, bet no ones tried :)
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Mon Feb 28, 2011 8:27 pm

blufawn wrote:How could we know if a wolf could herd, bet no ones tried :)
Haha, well that may be true - but with a prey drive like a wolf has, I'm pretty sure the sheep might become dinner ;) It seems like most wolfdogs couldn't be trusted in that sort of situation.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by kendrrat » Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:50 pm

i too think its admirable that they strive for intelligence and trainablility within the breed, whatever the wolf content may be. thats not something you see often, or ever really. very refreshing. the dogs' will to please i think definitely shows the presence of the "dog" part of their make up but doesnt necessarily mean there is little/no wolf. all it seems we're doing here is speculating about content, guessing based on pictures and stories and what we think we might know.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Sylvaen » Thu May 12, 2011 3:34 pm

From Buckhorn (Aatu Breeder):
Alaskan Noble Companion Dog

The ANCD is also a new breed in progress. The founder, a geneticist, beginning in 1991, has created a black phase "wolf look-a-like" composed of herding, northern, retriever, sheep guarding, and sighthound breeds. Specifically the following breakdown:

Herding Group: German Shepherd, Border Collie
Northern Working Group: Malamute, Siberian Husky
Retrieving Group: Black Lab
Sheep Guarding Group: Great Pyrenees
Sighthound Group: Greyhound

The founder of this "noble breed" only sells by personal recommendation and has no web site to reference. Do not confuse the Alaskan Noble with The North American Noble Dog bred by Noblepawz. They are not one in the same.

Noble family... Pepsi, Cola & Xena
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Iowa, son of Pepsi
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4/14/11: Introducing Dresselhaus Rook @ Buckhorn. Son of Dresselhaus Pepsi and Dresselhaus Starbuck, born 2/15/11. CERF clear. He is not a solid black phase like his mom Pepsi and has a very mild temperment. We anticipate he will be more "wolf" marked like the Aatu Tamaskan and should develop a nice masking. Possible eye colorations will likely be 50% amber/golden, 25% light yellow or 25% brown. See picture gallery for Rook photos.
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http://www.buckhorntamaskan.com/alaskannoble.htm
INFO from a good friend of Ann Dresselhaus:
You are talking about Ann Dresselhaus her dogs. I am mailing everyday with Ann, because she has a litter with XXX´s grandaunt which is about 1 month older than mine. We wanted to trade dogs, but I preferred to take one from XXX´s greatgrandmother, but Xena did not get pups - she is 12. So I do not want to trade with a dog from Pepsi, because there is too much dog mixed in, the father is dog and grandfather is dog and they do not look so good only one of five (the black one). Ann has now her own youtube channel http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAnnDDDDD

I am curious which dogs from Ann you are talking about. Of course there is wolf in them.
You can watch the last video from her which shows XXX´s greatgrandma Xena.

As for these "wolf-like animals without wolf in it"... Do you know why people tell such nonsense? Because they do not want to have trouble with the authorities. This is the only reason and that is the reason why Ann founded her Alaskan Noble CDs. However, the recent litter from Pepsi: Starbuck, the father, is a normal dog (not bred from her) and the father of Pepsi is Appollo a pure dog too. Pepsi is a daughter to Xena and you can see in the video exactly what she is. But Ann never would confirm this! XXX is a daughter of Wicca, a sister from Pepsi.

Mace Loftus has a sister to Xena and Mace has normally only pure wolves, hahaha, called wolfdogs.
Same like Lorraine from Winddancer and Mark from Wildcatranch.
So then why do they claim that the ANCD was created by mixing the following breeds?

Herding Group: German Shepherd, Border Collie
Northern Working Group: Malamute, Siberian Husky
Retrieving Group: Black Lab
Sheep Guarding Group: Great Pyrenees
Sighthound Group: Greyhound

When the fact is that ANCD are wolfdogs, mixed with GSD (White Swiss Shepherd, etc)...
For that matter, do they even know the history of the German Shepherd (Alsatian Wolfdog)??

Before jumping to conclusions and believing everything that is published on the internet, it is wise to think very carefully about MOTIVE. Who is writing what, and why... you will see that a lot of the drama has to do with politics and personal agendas. Sadly there is a lot of it in the dog breeding world: to some, it's all about ego :roll: and 'competition' ($$) instead of the love of the breed and the concern for its future. :evil:
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sat Jun 04, 2011 8:31 am

Regarding the Alaskan Noble Companion Dog, it seems that these could be expressing a recessive gene for black coats. Or if its not recessive it could be a gene that follows some other mendellian mode of inheritance, co-dominance for example. Black wolves in North America are the result of a recessive gene passed from dog/wolf matings way back and in some packs black wolves are found in every litter. In some dogs, GSD for example, there are several "types" of black- at least one recessive gene responsible for solid black coats. Other black GSDs exhibit the darker gradient of the normal coat coloring.

My point being, if the ANCD is homozygous for a recessive mutant black gene, all crosses with Aatu Tams will produce 100% heterozygous offspring which means that down the line a large number of Aatu tams will be black. This defeats the purpose of having a tam since the primary interest in tams is as a grey wolfy looking dog.

EDIT: I've since discovered that besides dominant black (K), there are a few other genes at play including agouti (A) which is what tams are. So ANCDs, particularly agouti ones, could produce very interesting offspring if crossed with a tam, not only black.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Sylvaen » Sat Jun 04, 2011 1:12 pm

martinbernstein wrote:My point being, if the ANCD is homozygous for a recessive mutant black gene, all crosses with Aatu Tams will produce 100% heterozygous offspring which means that down the line a large number of Aatu tams will be black. This defeats the purpose of having a tam since the primary interest in tams is as a grey wolfy looking dog.
This is true. Moreover, some of the ANCD bloodlines also carry liver (brown: bb) and dilute black (blue: dd). While both these colors are relatively rare and can look really nice, these coat colors aren't particularly 'wolf-like'.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Sat Jun 04, 2011 1:54 pm

The wolf-grey color does look the most wolfy, but still I would love to have a Tam that looks like a black phase wolf! I really like the black ANCD :)

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by MoirAran » Sat Jun 04, 2011 3:48 pm

It seems, that there are wolves with the blue color in the wild. I believe in America (maybe I can find the website/article where I read this).

Black phase wolves and ANCD's are sooooo beautiful indeed.

Don't think wolfy-looking is only depending on the color of the coat ;)
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sat Jun 04, 2011 8:44 pm

MoirAran wrote: Black phase wolves and ANCD's are sooooo beautiful indeed.

Don't think wolfy-looking is only depending on the color of the coat ;)
I agree, I love black phase wolves and the ANCD is certainly an impressive looking dog with wolfy characteristics.

My point is that, if the ANCD's black coat is due to the expression of a recessive gene (which may or may not be the case), and you use several ANCD's to expand a very small gene pool, it won't take many generations before all Aatus are carriers of the "black" gene which means that soon every single litter will produce some black pups. If you want a black phase tam, fine, but with a small and closed gene pool the normal grey tam might become rarer than the black phase.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Sat Jun 04, 2011 8:56 pm

martinbernstein wrote:
MoirAran wrote: Black phase wolves and ANCD's are sooooo beautiful indeed.

Don't think wolfy-looking is only depending on the color of the coat ;)
I agree, I love black phase wolves and the ANCD is certainly an impressive looking dog with wolfy characteristics.

My point is that, if the ANCD's black coat is due to the expression of a recessive gene (which may or may not be the case), and you use several ANCD's to expand a very small gene pool, it won't take many generations before all Aatus are carriers of the "black" gene which means that soon every single litter will produce some black pups. If you want a black phase tam, fine, but with a small and closed gene pool the normal grey tam might become rarer than the black phase.
If it is recessive then I don't think it will go that fast. There are a few black-grey tams, several have been bred to wolf-grey tams and the color is still very rare. Ofcourse if they will use more ANCD's then Tamaskan then it might end up like that.. I think it's a great choice to use the ANCD as an outcross but I would probably only use one or max. two (from different lines) in the breed.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sat Jun 04, 2011 9:54 pm

Considering that there are only two Aatu bitches that have bred, and perhaps a handful more that will be ready to breed in the next year or two, I think black coats could become common very quickly if the ANCD stud is bred to more than one of those bitches and the gene is recessive. But this is all speculation at this point. Anyway, as far as I know, there isn't such a thing as two different line of ANCDs. There are only a handful of them and they are all closely related.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sun Jun 05, 2011 3:13 am

I think I must revise my initial concern. I just watched a nice vid of Pepsi, an ANCD bitch and her pups. Some are light colored, others sable and others black. So clearly there are more genes at play here. What an awesome breed too, the videos demonstrate the workability and intelligence of this dog.


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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Valravn » Sun Jun 05, 2011 3:33 am

Personally I don't believe they do not have wolf. That video especially makes me think they are (mid?) wolfdogs.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sun Jun 05, 2011 4:34 am

Chiarosa wrote:Personally I don't believe they do not have wolf. That video especially makes me think they are (mid?) wolfdogs.
The same has been said of the tamaskan ;) Who's to say? There's no proof that there is wolf content, and no proof that there isn't. They don't act like wolves, in fact they resemble border collies both physically and behaviorally. If there is indeed some wolf content, the wolfy behavior appears to have been bred out.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Lyss » Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:56 am

Sylvaen wrote:So then why do they claim that the ANCD was created by mixing the following breeds?

Herding Group: German Shepherd, Border Collie
Northern Working Group: Malamute, Siberian Husky
Retrieving Group: Black Lab
Sheep Guarding Group: Great Pyrenees
Sighthound Group: Greyhound
Going to summarize a bit here:
- Labs were for temperament and retrieving/working ability (mostly farm labs)
- Border Collies were for good working ability, temperament, and body conformation
- Great Pyrenees were for size, bone, and coat and for some more laid-back temperaments
- Greyhounds were for body conformation
- GSDs, Sibs, and Mals were used mainly for the same reason every other wolf look-alike breed uses them as foundation stock. Ann focused on finding individuals with long legs, thick coats, lighter eyes, and wilder coat colors.
martinbernstein wrote:
Chiarosa wrote:Personally I don't believe they do not have wolf. That video especially makes me think they are (mid?) wolfdogs.
The same has been said of the tamaskan ;) Who's to say? There's no proof that there is wolf content, and no proof that there isn't. They don't act like wolves, in fact they resemble border collies both physically and behaviorally. If there is indeed some wolf content, the wolfy behavior appears to have been bred out.
Agreeing with Martin here. My girl doesn't exhibit classical wolf-like behaviors, and I see a lot of the above breeds in her appearance and temperament. Physically, of course, she doesn't really resemble a wolf pup now anyway, as her ears are still floppy (she's the pup in my pic). Hopefully those things will perk up soon :lol:

She isn't from the litter in that video. She's from a separate litter (same father, different mother).

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Rahne » Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:58 am

I don't care if there is wolf in it or not. The ANCD seems to have great temperament and very trainable :)
It's such a shame you can't really find a lot of info about them, I'm very curious.

@Lyss: It would be nice if you could keep us updated with stories and pictures of your pup :D

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by wen » Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:58 am

they really are stunning, and, as usual, my preferrence goes to grey ones.

Lyss, could you post pictures of your dog ?
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Sun Jun 05, 2011 4:09 pm

I just find it all very fishy, but mainly because I cant find breeders, I cant find pictures, I cant find references to foundation dogs. According to the OFA they have had 6 dogs (5 bred by the same person) health tested, well either they only have 6 breeding dogs or they just arent testing them...... 45 Tamaskan have been hip scored since our breed started 9 years ago, they say their breed has been going for 20 years, its just hard to take them seriously as an established breed......


Noble Paws has on their website. Home to the rare breed in progress the alaskan noble companion dog. Based in Canada, our wolfdogs are guaranteed to turn heads with their majestic, ...

Does anyone have a link to a breeder or website other than Noblepawz, because she is mixing ANCD with wolf hybrids according to her site information and so not a true breeder of pure ANCD's
Are there any actual breeders of ANCD and them only?
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Lyss » Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:38 pm

Sure, I could post some pics and info for you guys :)

There are only about 100 Nobles, and the deepest generations are about 5 levels deep. I think some of the dogs used on OFA are listed as mixed breeds rather than Alaskan Nobles. Have you checked the CERF database? I believe there are more Nobles listed there than in the OFA databases. I'm not sure if there are any other breeders who breed Alaskan Nobles specifically besides Ann, but here's the official Alaskan Noble website (under construction) now that their popularity is growing (I think it only has the Noble breed standard on it right now):

http://alaskannoblecd.weebly.com/index.html

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by blufawn » Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:39 pm

hummm, what on earth does this mean 'The Alaskan Noble Companion Dog is an eclectic breed and the ultimate generalist.'

I dont really know anything about USA standards, but the whole thing looks crazy.

On the standard page the dog on the left looks like a badly bred white shepherd, the dog in the middle kind of looks like a friends CED and the dog on the right looks like a wolf dog, very inconsistent.

I have nothing against the dogs or the breeder or what she is trying to do, but I dont feel this is an established breed anymore than American Tamaskan if there is just one breeder.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Lyss » Sun Jun 05, 2011 7:02 pm

I take no offense at all and completely understand! :)

I believe it just means the dog has various talents and is capable of most kinds of work.

I don't think the standard is written according to KC rules, but it's her vision of where the breed is going.

As for inconsistencies, I will say this: she is still adding foundation stock to establish different traits in her breed (i.e. she's working on establishing a liver colored line in her dogs).

And like I said, I don't know if there are any other breeders besides Ann. I do know that her breeding quality dogs who go to homes like mine are preferably kept intact so as to be included in her breeding program.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by martinbernstein » Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:14 pm

blufawn wrote:hummm, what on earth does this mean 'The Alaskan Noble Companion Dog is an eclectic breed and the ultimate generalist.'

I dont really know anything about USA standards, but the whole thing looks crazy.

On the standard page the dog on the left looks like a badly bred white shepherd, the dog in the middle kind of looks like a friends CED and the dog on the right looks like a wolf dog, very inconsistent.

I have nothing against the dogs or the breeder or what she is trying to do, but I dont feel this is an established breed anymore than American Tamaskan if there is just one breeder.
I'm not very knowledgeable about the breed, but I've been in touch with some owners about it and asked many questions. From what I understand, the goal of creating this breed has not been in the vein of the victorian-era obsession with conformation. Unlike tams, who were specifically bred to resemble wolves and whose breed standard places great emphasis on appearance, the ANCD is bred with an equal emphasis on particular behavioral traits as well as appearances. Naturally you will end up with a more physiologically diverse population when selecting for behaviors.

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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Ciaobella » Mon Jun 06, 2011 1:03 pm

I only skimmed this post so i dont know if this was metioned already, but here is a post from another forum im apart of and the member said this about the Alaskan that she either found or was emailed or something.
More info on the ANCD:

Health Testing:
All pup's parents are in the OFA and CERF database under "Alaskan Noble Companion Dog" as breed name: https://secure.offa.org/search.html
Some earlier Foundation Stock can also be found under Breed: = "Hybrid" (Note: Hybrid simply means any mixed breed in the OFA database).

All pups will have a CERF(eye) certification before going to new owners: http://sunnycrest.vmdb.org/CERFVerify/, which is conveniently cross referenced in the OFA database if the dog has a previous OFA record.

All breeding stock is OFAed Good or Excellent or Penn-Hipped at a DI of .4 or better and their eyes have passed CERF(above). Some of the more recent dogs have OFAed elbows and knees and have had miscellaneous other genetic tests run on them as they become available.


Temperament Testing:
Parents have an AKC CGC (Canine Good Citizenship) as a minimum temperament requirement before breeding and the breeding stock that has been spayed and neutered (after contributing) have passed the ATTS (American Temperament Test Society) Test. As a further demonstration of working ability the Noble family has a huge reservoir of titles behind them including:

Herding titles from the AHBA and ASCA; Agility titles from NADAC, AMBOR, and UKC; Rally Obedience titles from APDT Rally-O Obedience and the AKC; Therapy Dog titles from Delta Society,
Therapy Dog International, and Kirkwood Community College; Schutzhund titles from USCA; Conformation titles from the IABCA; CGC titles from the AKC; Obedience titles from the AKC; and Temperament titles from ATTS.

That's better than a lot of purebred doggy-dog breeders...so there are definitely worse out there.
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Re: Alaskan Noble Companion Dog (ANCD)

Post by Kootenaywolf » Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:59 am

I see there's lots more in this topic since I last checked!

I would say it's as established a breed as say, the Tamaskan. There aren't as many ANCDs, I think Ann is the only breeder as yet but other people keep stud dogs or have occasional litters. However the breed has been in progress for nearly 20 years now. There is definitely a lot of variation in look, but that is because specific working temperament is also being bred for. And, not only one colour (like wolf grey) - there are blackphase dogs, white, agouti, liver, etc.

There isn't much info out there but more than there used to be, now there is the beginnings of a website and also the youtube channel. I think more will be added to the website soon. But I definitely wouldn't say there is anything fishy or crazy about the breed. It's just a breed in progress like any other, only the founder was keeping it pretty quiet for a long time.

Lyss, is your puppy from Starbuck and Fresca? I would love to see pictures!

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