Ratliff

Info about scams and false advertisements relating to the sale of Tamaskan Dogs (or fake "Tamaskans").
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Hiwatari
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Ratliff

Post by Hiwatari » Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:44 pm

They tested their dogs, both Dam's came back having HD. But their still planning to use them. It seem people with their puppies know this, but still want puppies from them as their "Vet" told them it wouldn't hurt their dam's to have puppies. At least that is what their telling people who know. They also kept a puppy from a litter and plan to use him in another year.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by HiTenshi16 » Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:11 pm

This is no surprise to me :evil: Especially him being associated with RPK. Soon enough I'm sure he will end up just like RPK and look for any "wolffish looking" dog and add it to his "breeding program" and end up with dogs that look nothing like a Tamaskan. I feel sorry for anyone uneducated or just foolish enough to buy from them.
All they care about is the money they make off the poor dogs. Breeding dogs (no matter what breed) should be seen only as a hobby, not a business or source of income.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Katlin » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:02 pm

:roll: can't say this surprises me, disgusted and annoyed, yes, but surprised? Nope. They've learned from Kevin.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Hiwatari » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:30 pm

I hoped they learned off Kevin what not to do as they said they would health test to someone that they wanted a puppy from. They kept their word on testing, however don't care about what it says. But that person is willing to get a puppy from them and to still sell them a puppy. I couldn't believe that. When I asked about it, they told me his vet said the dam's could breed without a problem. Most Vet's see nothing but money when it comes to dogs and them breeding. Your very lucky when you find one that doesn't care about the money.

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Re: Ratliff

Post by Katlin » Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:17 pm

Most Vet's see nothing but money when it comes to dogs and them breeding. Your very lucky when you find one that doesn't care about the money.
Absolutely not. I find that very hard to believe that the USA is so different than Canada in the situation. Vets believe in the health of the animal, in fact most vets here (probably...80-90%) frown upon breeding. AAHA (American Animal Hospital Association) also are not fans of breeders, professional or backyard. Sorry but I totally disagree with your statement.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by HiTenshi16 » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:04 pm

Agreed with Katlin, even though my vets promote Science Diet so they can get more money from that, they will try and find something lower cost for you so you can afford helping your animal get better. So, they do want the money, but they are putting our animals health first.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Sylvaen » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:34 pm

Katlin wrote:Absolutely not. I find that very hard to believe that the USA is so different than Canada in the situation. Vets believe in the health of the animal, in fact most vets here (probably...80-90%) frown upon breeding. AAHA (American Animal Hospital Association) also are not fans of breeders, professional or backyard. Sorry but I totally disagree with your statement.
I totally agree with Katlin.
Keep in mind, we only have Ratliff's WORD that his vet told him it is 'OK' - for all we know, his vet might have told him NOT to use those dogs for breeding and he just decided to do it anyway. It is very easy for him to lie and say that his vet supports him, and this is also another way for him to shift the blame. Does anyone know which vet clinic Ratliff uses?
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Re: Ratliff

Post by TerriHolt » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:53 am

Katlin wrote:
Most Vet's see nothing but money when it comes to dogs and them breeding. Your very lucky when you find one that doesn't care about the money.
Absolutely not. I find that very hard to believe that the USA is so different than Canada in the situation. Vets believe in the health of the animal, in fact most vets here (probably...80-90%) frown upon breeding. AAHA (American Animal Hospital Association) also are not fans of breeders, professional or backyard. Sorry but I totally disagree with your statement.

Not necessarily true unless the uk is rapidly different to the rest of the world (or we got the worst hand full of vets ever)... The only vet we have in town (the next is an hour drive away to they get any emergencies) cares about money over anything else :( I really don't like them...

We had an old ex guide dog we acquired off a family friend when our friend passed.
When it was "his time" go to, we knew but the vet persuaded us that this medication, liquid and tablets would work. Well, even tho we knew better, we kinda clung to the hope it would work as you do but he just got rapidly worse over the 2 days until we had to call them out. they tried to say we cold try something else but then my mum said no, enough is enough.

Every pet we had, we have had to fight past the "we cold try this"... They know you are losing a pet and they are losing business so they try to palm as much expense off on you as they can, no matter how much distress you are in. They give false hope even tho they know it won't work....

Sam had sore testicles, the vet told me it would clear up on it's own.
Went out the room, came back in and then said "this will help" and gave me some spray that remarkably resembled water in a spray bottle for £25... Just in case he was right, even after saying it will clear up on it's own, i invested in some because i didn't wan his uncomfortable longer then needed (and consultation fee goes up to £19 from £13 when you don't take medication so if i'm paying a lot, i want something out of it)....
I can, with all honesty say, they are more about money than the welfare of pets...

Wonder how many £ signs hey see when it comes to breeding and how much unnecessary medication they palm off on you then? (and they work with the RSPCA).
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Tiantai » Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:04 pm

Yep, as most of us here knew from the start, Ratliff is no different from RPK. :evil:
His "words" never convinces me at all seeing that he sided with that maniac from the start so it doesn't surprise me that he would go off lying and still knowingly breed dogs with a high chance of passing HD down to the pups that he's planning to sell off to the potential buyers. Puppy millers will always be puppy millers no matter how "friendlier" some may behave than others.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Hiwatari » Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:11 pm

I'm sorry but out the the six vets I know and have gone to, only one of them isn't in it for the money that I found. All the rest want money. I'm not saying their all bad Vet's, but they want the money.

I had a vet tell me that being a Vet doesn't pay enough so they breed dogs on the side that they don't health test because the OFA is a load of crap. Needless to say, I stopped going to them as they told me Akira would be fine for breeding and the OFA was wrong, without even looking at her X-rays.

So yes most vets are in it for the money, but it doesn't mean their not good.

I've been to one vet that didn't charge an arm and a leg and would even go out and say not to charge someone if their pet wasn't any problems. Or they would take a large number of pets as one visit not how many you brought in.

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Re: Ratliff

Post by arianwenarie » Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:17 pm

I think this thread is going a little bit off topic and possibly now is a good time to let us move to the two relevant threads about choosing a vet:

Breeder Vets: viewtopic.php?f=65&t=3536
Choosing A Vet: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1648 (older topic)

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Re: Ratliff

Post by TerriHolt » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:55 pm

Sorry :oops:

It's infuriating when people knowing risk HD in dogs... A vet said my GSD must have come from a BYB who's not bothered with testing. Her mobility slowed at about 5 ish and rapidly got worse... I don't understand why people knowingly buy them either... Is it because they don't know about the parents? Do they not know how much the dogs can suffer? Or is is prely because they want wolfy looking dogs regardless of health?

I have seen people singing his praises about how good he is to deal with compared with RPK but no breeder is worth the poop the dogs produce knowingly breeding dogs than can have pups with health problems...
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Nino » Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:43 pm

I know that this is off topic but I really have to give in a word on the Vet topic..

I have been to several vets over the years - even did an internship some years back, and at least Here, in Denmark, with the vets that I have known and been using they are NOT just all about the money..

Yes you have to keep in mind that it IS their bread and butter and therefore they WILL charge you an amount, but giving that I with most have been seen by at least two people (the vet and an assistant or two vets in some cases rven) and only a few times by just one (in which cases they actually charged less) I also think that the amount of money I have paid have been absolutely fair..
I can also say that I have had exams (and vacination even) 3 times by two different vets that did not even charge me!
And still I changed one of them because I did not feel he informed me well enough and the other one because he was simply too long away..
The vets I use for Sølve she liked from day one which is something special with her being she normally is not too fond of strangers right away, they arent the cheapest that is true, but Sølve likes them and that is more important I think.. Also they radiate a love for animals and peace which I am sure was what Sølve reacted on :)

Saying this.. You have to compare to any other job.. You would not expect a web deceloper to work for free or less than he could love for, neither would you expect a shop owner to do.. Then why should a Vet be any different? They might love animals but if they work for free they cannot live..
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Tatzel » Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:36 am

TerriHolt wrote:Do they not know how much the dogs can suffer? Or is is prely because they want wolfy looking dogs regardless of health?
Probably also somehwta off-topic, but I think that not being able to wait for a puppy is a huge factor why people get dogs from Ratliff, RPK AND places alike.

A lot of breeders (especially of 'rare' breeds) have long waiting lists - obviously for good reasons because they don't breed the shit out of their dogs every time they come into heat - and some people just can't wait for months to possibly years.

I think this has something to do with the general mentality of our modern civilication; everyone wants everything right away. People are incredibly impatient, for example instead of saving money to buy a house or car, they just get a credit and reward themselves right away. I guess it's kind of self-reeinforcing, why wait if you can get something right away?
People fail to see the bigger picture; the loan which comes back on them often with a hefty interesst, and in case of backyard breeders, an unhealthy dog with perhaps even a shorter-than-usual lifespan.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Tiantai » Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:46 am

I've visited several veterinary clinics here in Toronto in the past and as far as I'm aware, ALL of them put health over money. I have never met any who would recommend breeding even after several health testings came out with bad results. To me, IF a vet actually approves of any breedings of a female with hip problems, bone fracture, or any severe issues in the dog even if not seenable to the naked eye, that vet should have their licence stripped from them. That's my opinion anyways.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Sylvaen » Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:12 am

Tatzel wrote:A lot of breeders (especially of 'rare' breeds) have long waiting lists - obviously for good reasons because they don't breed the shit out of their dogs every time they come into heat - and some people just can't wait for months to possibly years.

I think this has something to do with the general mentality of our modern civilication; everyone wants everything right away. People are incredibly impatient, for example instead of saving money to buy a house or car, they just get a credit and reward themselves right away. I guess it's kind of self-reeinforcing, why wait if you can get something right away?
People fail to see the bigger picture; the loan which comes back on them often with a hefty interesst, and in case of backyard breeders, an unhealthy dog with perhaps even a shorter-than-usual lifespan.
Well said!
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Katlin » Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:23 am

So yes most vets are in it for the money, but it doesn't mean their not good.
Agree to disagree. :roll: :lol:
Sylvaen wrote:
Tatzel wrote:A lot of breeders (especially of 'rare' breeds) have long waiting lists - obviously for good reasons because they don't breed the shit out of their dogs every time they come into heat - and some people just can't wait for months to possibly years.

I think this has something to do with the general mentality of our modern civilication; everyone wants everything right away. People are incredibly impatient, for example instead of saving money to buy a house or car, they just get a credit and reward themselves right away. I guess it's kind of self-reeinforcing, why wait if you can get something right away?
People fail to see the bigger picture; the loan which comes back on them often with a hefty interesst, and in case of backyard breeders, an unhealthy dog with perhaps even a shorter-than-usual lifespan.
Well said!
Agreed! VERY well said.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Hiwatari » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:15 am

Back to back litters as well
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Tatzel » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:44 am

Disgusting!
These people have no compassion for dogs, all they see are the dollar bills! :evil:
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Re: Ratliff

Post by HiTenshi16 » Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:36 am

:evil: Can't stand them, really wish there was some way to rescue to dogs from them and ban them from owning any animal.
I just wish people would do their homework better or stop being so impatient and not buy from them at all.
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Re: Ratliff

Post by Tiantai » Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:18 pm

I don't understand how is it that some people on facebook could possible think that the Ratliff's are better than RPK when they're doing basically the same crap as that madman! :evil:
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Re: Ratliff

Post by TerriHolt » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:39 pm

HiTenshi16 wrote::evil: Can't stand them, really wish there was some way to rescue to dogs from them and ban them from owning any animal.
I just wish people would do their homework better or stop being so impatient and not buy from them at all.
Me too :evil:
Tiantai wrote:I don't understand how is it that some people on facebook could possible think that the Ratliff's are better than RPK when they're doing basically the same crap as that madman! :evil:
Agreed. all the defense he still gets on fb yet he is no better than RPK... I just don't get it... HD wasn't a problem to them because he cares about his dogs and cares well for his pups... Does it work the same for back to back mating's too?
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There’s a battle between two wolves inside us all.
One is Evil. It’s anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego.
The other is Good. It’s joy, peace, love, hope, humility, kindness and truth.

The wolf that wins? The one you feed!

~ Cherokee Proverb

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity... I'm not sure about the former.

~ Albert Einstein

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Re: Ratliff

Post by Luccistar » Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:09 am

This is so sad... I hope something can/will/has been done to stop them. Any news on the matter?

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Re: Ratliff

Post by Hiwatari » Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:46 pm

Nothing has changed, only plus has been a few of his puppy owners no longer supporting him... :( Not much, but it's something. All of Ivy's 10 puppies have been "Adopted" (guess he is hiding names now?) and he already has 4 from his next unlisted litter sold.

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