Intact Male

All topics pertaining to agility, obedience, sled racing, search & rescue, therapy training, etc.
Post Reply
User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Sun May 08, 2011 12:10 am

Every time I take Wave to the beach other dogs in the vicinity bark/growl at him. All the dogs are on leashes so no worries there. But why is he getting that negative response? Is it because of his size & being intact? He completely ignores them and continues on....he doesn't so much give them a sideward glance. Such a gentleman ;) But its strange as we pass along that other dogs, who look content & happy, change into barking/growling dogs as we pass. There is multiple people on the beach walking their dog and none of them appear to respond to the others that way EXCEPT to Wave. This is the 3rd weekend in a row we have taken him and it happened each time?? Or maybe they are all Duke fans instead of NCSU Wolfpack fans? ;)

User avatar
Tarheel
Tamtastic (Apprentice)
Tamtastic (Apprentice)
Posts: 482
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 1:37 am
Location: North Carolina USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Tarheel » Sun May 08, 2011 4:49 am

All those other dogs are just jealous. They want to be Wave but they can never be Wave.
John Bannow
Tarheel Tamaskan
Committee of Breeders

User avatar
blufawn
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1758
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 1:10 pm
Location: Lincs, UK

Re: Intact Male

Post by blufawn » Sun May 08, 2011 9:22 am

I agree with John :D
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
.............................................................
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!

User avatar
TerriHolt
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3274
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:56 am
Location: UK, East Yorkshire
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by TerriHolt » Sun May 08, 2011 9:31 am

Wave2Tuffy wrote:He completely ignores them and continues on....he doesn't so much give them a sideward glance. Such a gentleman ;)
he's probibly wondering what their problem is him self :lol:

i have been wondering the same... but not with outher dogs barking/growling.

i walked past a dog, the woman was happy for me to let sam say hello but the dog backed off. she apologised A LOT and said she's NEVER had a problem with introducing her dog to other dogs and it's never backed away... not even from the greats (danes).

the same thing has happened with 4 other dogs that aparently has never had a problem but they all back off... it did get me thinking but came up with nothing...

it can't be cuz he's intact with him only been 4 month (and a few weeks) old can it??? the vet said not (but my vets sucks) but i was just wondering on a 2nd opinion...
Image

There’s a battle between two wolves inside us all.
One is Evil. It’s anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego.
The other is Good. It’s joy, peace, love, hope, humility, kindness and truth.

The wolf that wins? The one you feed!

~ Cherokee Proverb

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity... I'm not sure about the former.

~ Albert Einstein

User avatar
Blustag
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 2971
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:53 am
Location: UK

Re: Intact Male

Post by Blustag » Sun May 08, 2011 10:37 am

No its definately not because he is 'entire'. I never have any probs with any of my stud dogs when out. I really dont know what it is sorry never come across it.

User avatar
Gaby
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1205
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 1:08 am
Location: Groningen, the Netherlands

Re: Intact Male

Post by Gaby » Sun May 08, 2011 10:55 am

How old is Wave now? And what do you do when it happens?

It could be something in his attitude what other dogs see but we can't. The only thing I would do is making sure he stays well behaved like he is now and reward him every time he ignores an other dog that is barking/growling. Make sure to him that you keep him safe from these dogs so that he doesn't think at a time that he should do something himself to shut them up. Because he is strong and big, you just don't want him to take the matter in his own paws, if you know what I mean with my bad English. ;)

User avatar
Tarheel
Tamtastic (Apprentice)
Tamtastic (Apprentice)
Posts: 482
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 1:37 am
Location: North Carolina USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Tarheel » Sun May 08, 2011 11:33 am

Lisa,
I remember a post that you said that Wave did well on some exam and was relaxed , but you failed. You may be putting off this same tension when walking Wave around ther dogs, and these other dogs are reacting to you and not Wave.
Just a thought.
John Bannow
Tarheel Tamaskan
Committee of Breeders

User avatar
Blustag
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 2971
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:53 am
Location: UK

Re: Intact Male

Post by Blustag » Sun May 08, 2011 11:49 am

Sorry I didnt go into more detail as was in a hurry but the posts above are sound advice. You can unknowningly pass tension down the lead to your dog and maybe he is unbeknown to you giving signs to other dogs. Just try to relax and perhaps cross the road or move away when you see the other males approaching but not making it very obvious to Wave.

User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Sun May 08, 2011 1:20 pm

Actually, at the beach its zero on nervous.....most of the dogs we dont even notice until they go nuts as we pass. We dont come nose to nose or even close. No need to be nervous. Wave is praised the entire time with "good boy". Maybe he does strut a little? :lol: He doesn't flinch, he doesn't look at them, he reacts no different. Actually,we recognize his "lock n stare" that can provoke or send a negative signal. When he does that we distract him and praise again for not reacting but listening to us. Wave is 2 years old.

On Waves "learn how to relax" evaluation. I failed. That is close proximity nose to nose...butt to nose, whatever. Since Wave has had several bad experiences with inappropriate dogs MY confidence & trust in other dogs has dropped. He is a sensitive sweet boy ;) and I became too protective. Still my nervousness is strictly in closed spaces nose to nose.

This also happens when Joe took him on the beach......Joe has never had a nervous problem like me!

Do you think it could be the opposite? The owners of THOSE dogs get scared because Wave looks like a wolf & he is big? So maybe those dogs feel like they have to protect their owners fear?

User avatar
Nino
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3106
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:13 am
Location: Aalborg - Denmark

Re: Intact Male

Post by Nino » Sun May 08, 2011 1:53 pm

Wave2Tuffy wrote:Do you think it could be the opposite? The owners of THOSE dogs get scared because Wave looks like a wolf & he is big? So maybe those dogs feel like they have to protect their owners fear?
It would have been my first guess..
>> Nino <<
Image

User avatar
Gaby
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1205
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 1:08 am
Location: Groningen, the Netherlands

Re: Intact Male

Post by Gaby » Sun May 08, 2011 4:55 pm

Wave2Tuffy wrote:Actually,we recognize his "lock n stare" that can provoke or send a negative signal. When he does that we distract him and praise again for not reacting but listening to us. Wave is 2 years old.
Maybe he is still staring at other dogs and with his (beautiful!) light eyes it is more obvious than with other dogs with brown eyes. There are dogs who react at our dog Rhodin because his eyes are so light and he can stare too. But this is very difficult to say from a computer screen. Can you film it maybe? I sure stay focused on it and try to find out the cause of it. Maybe with help from somebody who knows you and Wave.

User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Sun May 08, 2011 5:30 pm

I am taking him back to the beach Tuesday, he is being filmed there for a local commercial. I will try to do my own shoot as he walks with the others at the beach. BTW, he is in the commercial as "Wave" and not as the NCSU mascot.

User avatar
Nino
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3106
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:13 am
Location: Aalborg - Denmark

Re: Intact Male

Post by Nino » Sun May 08, 2011 7:15 pm

Wave2Tuffy wrote:I am taking him back to the beach Tuesday, he is being filmed there for a local commercial. I will try to do my own shoot as he walks with the others at the beach. BTW, he is in the commercial as "Wave" and not as the NCSU mascot.
Nice :)
Hoping to have a chance watching that commercial :D
>> Nino <<
Image

User avatar
TerriHolt
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3274
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:56 am
Location: UK, East Yorkshire
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by TerriHolt » Mon May 09, 2011 12:51 am

cool... GO WAVE!!! :D
Image

There’s a battle between two wolves inside us all.
One is Evil. It’s anger, jealousy, greed, resentment, inferiority, lies and ego.
The other is Good. It’s joy, peace, love, hope, humility, kindness and truth.

The wolf that wins? The one you feed!

~ Cherokee Proverb

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity... I'm not sure about the former.

~ Albert Einstein

User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Mon May 09, 2011 1:22 am

Gaby wrote:
Wave2Tuffy wrote:Actually,we recognize his "lock n stare" that can provoke or send a negative signal. When he does that we distract him and praise again for not reacting but listening to us. Wave is 2 years old.
Maybe he is still staring at other dogs and with his (beautiful!) light eyes it is more obvious than with other dogs with brown eyes. There are dogs who react at our dog Rhodin because his eyes are so light and he can stare too. But this is very difficult to say from a computer screen. Can you film it maybe? I sure stay focused on it and try to find out the cause of it. Maybe with help from somebody who knows you and Wave.
When we went for his evaluation the trainer was so impressed how he was so uninterested with other dogs negativity & stayed focused. I have had him in several different classes, he is about to start an advance class too, but all those classes only accepted neutered dogs. Once they met Wave he was allowed in those classes because he was so exceptional in temperament. I pay attention to his reaction as in ears, stance, body language, & head placement. Hopefully, I can get a video this Tuesday to share so you can see what I mean. To me, its just strange, how all the animals appear content until he walks by AND he does not acnowledge any of them or the owners.

User avatar
Gaby
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1205
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 1:08 am
Location: Groningen, the Netherlands

Re: Intact Male

Post by Gaby » Mon May 09, 2011 12:43 pm

Wave2Tuffy wrote:
Gaby wrote:
Wave2Tuffy wrote:Actually,we recognize his "lock n stare" that can provoke or send a negative signal. When he does that we distract him and praise again for not reacting but listening to us. Wave is 2 years old.
Maybe he is still staring at other dogs and with his (beautiful!) light eyes it is more obvious than with other dogs with brown eyes. There are dogs who react at our dog Rhodin because his eyes are so light and he can stare too. But this is very difficult to say from a computer screen. Can you film it maybe? I sure stay focused on it and try to find out the cause of it. Maybe with help from somebody who knows you and Wave.
When we went for his evaluation the trainer was so impressed how he was so uninterested with other dogs negativity & stayed focused. I have had him in several different classes, he is about to start an advance class too, but all those classes only accepted neutered dogs. Once they met Wave he was allowed in those classes because he was so exceptional in temperament. I pay attention to his reaction as in ears, stance, body language, & head placement. Hopefully, I can get a video this Tuesday to share so you can see what I mean. To me, its just strange, how all the animals appear content until he walks by AND he does not acnowledge any of them or the owners.
Wow, great that you have accomplished so much with Wave!! What a ridiculous rule that they only allow neutered dogs, like if that's the normal standard... :roll: You sound like you have so much experience, that it is almost impossible to say something helpful on a forum. ;) I start to believe that the other owners see Wave, get a bit scared or something like that and pass this tension on to their dogs. Or does this happen too on the dog classes? These owners know Wave, maybe that makes the difference.

User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Mon May 09, 2011 2:31 pm

Gaby wrote:Wow, great that you have accomplished so much with Wave!! What a ridiculous rule that they only allow neutered dogs, like if that's the normal standard... You sound like you have so much experience, that it is almost impossible to say something helpful on a forum. I start to believe that the other owners see Wave, get a bit scared or something like that and pass this tension on to their dogs. Or does this happen too on the dog classes? These owners know Wave, maybe that makes the difference.
Owning Wave has been a tremendous learning experience :) :) He has made me realize how much I don't know :oops: :oops: so I have been trying my best to gain knowledge along the way. ;) ;)

I never noticed any direct barking at Wave until recently. But then again in his earlier days he wasn't this big either? I'll let you know when he starts his next class in a couple of weeks.

User avatar
Hawthorne
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1817
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 11:07 pm
Location: Pennsylvania | USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Hawthorne » Tue May 10, 2011 9:16 pm

Hope the film shoot went well. Update? :)
Tracy Graziano
http://www.hawthornetamaskan.com

bark as if no one can hear you
catch the ball on the fly
lick like there's no end to kissing
sleep on a sofa nearby
jump like the sky is the limit
sit by the fire with friends
stay with the ones who love you
run like the road never ends

User avatar
Wave2Tuffy
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 360
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 7:41 pm

Re: Intact Male

Post by Wave2Tuffy » Tue May 10, 2011 11:47 pm

There was not 1 single dog today at the beach :lol: :lol: Soooo nothing to share. Wave did fine with the commercial accept when he was expected to sit & act like a loving sweet dog to a stranger. :oops: :oops: He wasn't feeling the love :lol: :lol:

User avatar
JulieSmith
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 2535
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Manchester, UK

Re: Intact Male

Post by JulieSmith » Tue May 10, 2011 11:49 pm

Wave2Tuffy wrote:There was not 1 single dog today at the beach :lol: :lol: Soooo nothing to share. Wave did fine with the comercial accept when he was expected to sit & act like a loving sweet dog to a stranger. :oops: :oops: He wasn't feeling the love :lol: :lol:
LOL, if the feeling is not there it is just not there, obviously they did not explain the motivation properly to him :lol: :lol: :lol:

User avatar
Hawthorne
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1817
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 11:07 pm
Location: Pennsylvania | USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Hawthorne » Sat May 14, 2011 9:18 pm

The treats must not have been good enough. :lol: :lol:
Tracy Graziano
http://www.hawthornetamaskan.com

bark as if no one can hear you
catch the ball on the fly
lick like there's no end to kissing
sleep on a sofa nearby
jump like the sky is the limit
sit by the fire with friends
stay with the ones who love you
run like the road never ends

User avatar
Eventide
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:07 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: Intact Male

Post by Eventide » Tue Nov 12, 2013 7:29 pm

I know this is an old post but it seemed appropriate to my question. Regarding the "lock and stare" when approaching or around other dogs, mostly other intact dogs, and never a bitch, Max does this all the time. I don't always catch it until the other dog responds aggressively at Max. He's so casual about it, there is no change in his demeanor or body, he just keeps walking or stops and just gives this innocent look (yea, right!).

I'm never quite sure if it's the other dog or he's doing it again. . . so, I generally air on the side of his staring and try to move him so he can't see the other dog. This usually starts him to growling and then they both sound like they're out to kill :| until I move him on quickly. He used to be so good about meeting and greeting all dogs, cats, rabbits, whatever.

He even does this at home when his best buddy comes to play. If he has a bone, his buddy won't even come in the room and will stand in the other room barking until I remove the bone.

As I know Wave is Max's uncle, can this be an inherited "trait" or is this something they all do as a "fight or flight" survival thing. Something like, "If I stare long and hard and stay ready and calm they won't mess with me?"

Is there a "fix" for this?
Image

User avatar
arianwenarie
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1244
Joined: Wed May 19, 2010 5:07 pm
Location: USA

Re: Intact Male

Post by arianwenarie » Tue Nov 12, 2013 7:35 pm

Eventide wrote:I know this is an old post but it seemed appropriate to my question. Regarding the "lock and stare" when approaching or around other dogs, mostly other intact dogs, and never a bitch, Max does this all the time. I don't always catch it until the other dog responds aggressively at Max. He's so casual about it, there is no change in his demeanor or body, he just keeps walking or stops and just gives this innocent look (yea, right!).

I'm never quite sure if it's the other dog or he's doing it again. . . so, I generally air on the side of his staring and try to move him so he can't see the other dog. This usually starts him to growling and then they both sound like they're out to kill :| until I move him on quickly. He used to be so good about meeting and greeting all dogs, cats, rabbits, whatever.

He even does this at home when his best buddy comes to play. If he has a bone, his buddy won't even come in the room and will stand in the other room barking until I remove the bone.

As I know Wave is Max's uncle, can this be an inherited "trait" or is this something they all do as a "fight or flight" survival thing. Something like, "If I stare long and hard and stay ready and calm they won't mess with me?"

Is there a "fix" for this?
Does he know any avoidance commands? i.e. look away, move on, etc. You can also try teaching him the 'behind' command where he positions himself behind you and sits there until you move aside.

If he's starting to guard high-value chews and/or toys when any doggie friends come over, then I'd advise to remove those items so that they're not a factor. ;)

User avatar
Katlin
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 2739
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 12:48 am
Location: Calgary, AB
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Katlin » Tue Nov 12, 2013 7:40 pm

Wylie used to do this, I taught him "Watch me". He'd look at me and hold my gaze, then get a treat. That's how we get past aggressive dogs or dogs Wylie wants to be dominant towards.
Polarose Tamaskan
Polardog Outfitters
Owner of Sierra Kaweah RN RI TDI TRN TTDN CRN-MCL @ Polarose

User avatar
Lynwae
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1306
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2011 11:37 am
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Lynwae » Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:47 am

For Max's owner, this is a normal behaviour change when a pup become a grown up intact dog.
This is your work to keep him having "good manners" :)

I think, when they really reach adulthood, if the owners did a good socialisation jobs, things goes smoother (like for wave), because the dogs are very self confident and calm and didn't feel like it's important to show other dogs they are in bad mood manners.

User avatar
Hawthorne
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1817
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 11:07 pm
Location: Pennsylvania | USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Hawthorne » Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:17 pm

Well said, Lynwae. I agree! Darwin was heavily socialized: went to doggie day care a LOT and went out into the world a lot.
He just didn't like Zephyr. LOL Can't expect all the kids to get along :P
Tracy Graziano
http://www.hawthornetamaskan.com

bark as if no one can hear you
catch the ball on the fly
lick like there's no end to kissing
sleep on a sofa nearby
jump like the sky is the limit
sit by the fire with friends
stay with the ones who love you
run like the road never ends

User avatar
Tiantai
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 2557
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:16 pm
Location: Canada (North York, Ontario)

Re: Intact Male

Post by Tiantai » Wed Nov 13, 2013 7:24 pm

Hawthorne wrote:Well said, Lynwae. I agree! Darwin was heavily socialized: went to doggie day care a LOT and went out into the world a lot.
He just didn't like Zephyr. LOL Can't expect all the kids to get along :P
Like I always say, every dog is different ;)
Image

User avatar
akaye531
Tamific (Novice)
Tamific (Novice)
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:04 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Intact Male

Post by akaye531 » Wed Nov 13, 2013 8:05 pm

Some male dogs were beginning to react aggressively to Mowgli (mostly other intact dogs around his age), but now that he's neutered I wonder if that will change...

User avatar
AZDehlin
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3039
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 4:52 am
Location: Upper Peninsula of Michigan, USA (for now)
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by AZDehlin » Fri Nov 15, 2013 2:01 am

Hawthorne wrote:Well said, Lynwae. I agree! Darwin was heavily socialized: went to doggie day care a LOT and went out into the world a lot.
He just didn't like Zephyr. LOL Can't expect all the kids to get along :P

And whats weird is before they ever mated another dog they got along fine so I am sure it had to do with them becoming mature intact males.

Zephyr has had two little spats(never blood) and it always been with another intact male when there was and intact female around. He doesn't stare though or growl just very confident and dominant looking in his posture.

User avatar
Hawthorne
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 1817
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 11:07 pm
Location: Pennsylvania | USA
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by Hawthorne » Fri Nov 15, 2013 9:03 pm

Yep. Which I think is totally normal.
Tracy Graziano
http://www.hawthornetamaskan.com

bark as if no one can hear you
catch the ball on the fly
lick like there's no end to kissing
sleep on a sofa nearby
jump like the sky is the limit
sit by the fire with friends
stay with the ones who love you
run like the road never ends

User avatar
AZDehlin
Tamificent (Guru)
Tamificent (Guru)
Posts: 3039
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 4:52 am
Location: Upper Peninsula of Michigan, USA (for now)
Contact:

Re: Intact Male

Post by AZDehlin » Thu Nov 21, 2013 1:18 am

Hawthorne wrote:Yep. Which I think is totally normal.
I think it depends how often intact males are with other intact males that makes the difference how they get a long.

Post Reply