Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

All topics pertaining to the sale of TDR registered Tamaskan puppies / adults, as well as international shipping.
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Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Fri Jan 24, 2014 9:13 pm

Outcross Litter: Ninja X Zora. Ninja is a registered (working line) Husky.

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Outcross Litter: Nanook X Vega. Nanook is a registered Marxdorfer.

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Pregnancy will be confirmed at the end of February. If Zora and/or Vega are pregnant, their puppies will be born at the end of March.
This means that their puppies will be ready to go to their new homes at the end of May.
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Fri Jan 24, 2014 10:54 pm

good luck :)

i like Ninja very much :D

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sat Jan 25, 2014 2:43 am

Balto wrote:good luck :)
Thanks! :D
Balto wrote:i like Ninja very much :D
Yeah, he's awesome...



BTW: from each litter, one male and one female pup will be available (for free) on co-ownership / breeding terms to people living in Croatia. :)
I will update my website soon, and include more info. ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:44 am

thats great :D
what is a Marxdorfer?
and how the outcrossing works, will the pups be tamaskan registered?

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:51 am

i read a outcrosses topic, so now i know what they are and what is a Marxdorfer :)

how many generation will pass till they produce full registered Tamaskan dogs..? i supose their pups will eventually mate with full registered Tams?
and how is interest from buyers for outcrosses.. are some of them going to other Tamaskan breeders?

sorry for so many questions, but im so interested in this.. as i still have to pass a Genetics exam on my college :D

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Tana » Sat Jan 25, 2014 12:11 pm

Oooh what a a good combinations! I wish you good luck too.
Sylvaen wrote:TW: from each litter, one male and one female pup will be available (for free) on co-ownership / breeding terms to people living in Croatia. :)
I will update my website soon, and include more info. ;)
What about to people living in Slovenia? :mrgreen:

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Nino » Sat Jan 25, 2014 3:52 pm

Will the dogs be TDR registered?
>> Nino <<
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Katlin » Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:37 pm

Tana wrote:Oooh what a a good combinations! I wish you good luck too.
Sylvaen wrote:TW: from each litter, one male and one female pup will be available (for free) on co-ownership / breeding terms to people living in Croatia. :)
I will update my website soon, and include more info. ;)
What about to people living in Slovenia? :mrgreen:
Or Canada ;) pllleeeeasseee Debby ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:45 pm

Balto wrote:how many generation will pass till they produce full registered Tamaskan dogs..? i supose their pups will eventually mate with full registered Tams?
and how is interest from buyers for outcrosses.. are some of them going to other Tamaskan breeders?
No worries :D
As the Tamaskan Dog is still a "breed-in-progress" (not yet FCI recognized) we have the freedom to add suitable outcrosses with the approval of the TDR Committee. The puppies from the outcross litters are then registered as Tamaskan puppies with Conditional Registration paperwork - to see how they turn out. If they meet the breed standard (and general requirements in terms of health, temperament and appearance) when they are 12 months old, then they are eligible for Full Registration and can be used as breeding dogs themselves (and their resulting puppies are issued with Full Registration paperwork).

We've already registered several outcross litters...

Maccoon X Avon
Jackal X Nanna (x2) - several pups from this combination went to breeding homes (Sequoia, Zephyr, Leia, etc) which have since produced the next generation of Tamaskan Dogs.
Bobbi X Summer - several pups from this combination went to breeding homes (Avak, Jaeger, Fly, Akim, Nanuq, etc) which have since produced the next generation of Tamaskan Dogs.
(And then all the litters from 2002-2006, and half the litters from 2007, were technically "outcross" litters as the breed did not become properly established until that point.)

Also, there were several recent outcross litters (in Germany and the Netherlands) which are technically were eligible for TDR Registration, but the breeders did not bother and only had the puppies registered via their (local) National Clubs instead...
Avak X Ziva
Phayos X Cheyenne

Yes, there is plenty of interest in these outcross puppies (including from other breeders) - after all, we need some fresh blood in our genepool. ;)
Tana wrote:What about to people living in Slovenia? :mrgreen:
We're only considering homes IN Croatia at this time (to people who we know very well and really trust) but maybe, in the future, we will consider people outside Croatia (within 0-3 hours drive or so). ;)
Katlin wrote:Or Canada ;) pllleeeeasseee Debby ;)
Canada is simply not an option for co-ownership / breeding terms.
Even Austria / Germany is too far for it to be practical (or fair) considering the terms and conditions.
Nino wrote:Will the dogs be TDR registered?
Yep. I don't really see the point in doing outcross litters if the pups won't be TDR registered. :)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Sat Jan 25, 2014 7:38 pm

i see that Ninja have some good background, up till Togo :D

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Tana » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:19 pm

Sylvaen wrote:IN Croatia
I know. I just couldn't resist not to ask a question ;) because I think they will be an amazing puppies considering appearance and character. I like video of Ninja where he is doing "dummy-training" :) And if I am remember correctly, you wanted to train Zora for SAR? Vega is great, I have her talented daughter at home. But what about Nanook, his character?

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Katlin » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:36 pm

Sylvaen wrote:
Katlin wrote:Or Canada ;) pllleeeeasseee Debby ;)
Canada is simply not an option for co-ownership / breeding terms.
Even Austria / Germany is too far for it to be practical (or fair) considering the terms and conditions.
Lol I know, I was just pulling your chain ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Taz » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:33 pm

I want one, not the right time though.*sulk*
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Jan 26, 2014 1:54 am

Balto wrote:i see that Ninja have some good background, up till Togo :D
Yep :D
Tana wrote:
Sylvaen wrote:IN Croatia
I know. I just couldn't resist not to ask a question ;) because I think they will be an amazing puppies considering appearance and character. I like video of Ninja where he is doing "dummy-training" :) And if I am remember correctly, you wanted to train Zora for SAR? Vega is great, I have her talented daughter at home. But what about Nanook, his character?
haha no worries :)

Both Zora and Ninja are highly intelligent and very open, friendly, and sociable. Zora is really playful and energetic (the clown of the pack) while Ninja is more focused... but both are very smart and learn new tricks quickly.

Vega is super cuddly and friendly with everyone (not as playful or as goofy as Zora; instead she will just stand near you and expect to be cuddled). Nanook is also very open and easy-going... great with children (like Vega) and very gentle. He's not particularly interested in playing with balls or toys, instead he prefers foraging / tracking games. He loves to be cuddled and petted.
Katlin wrote:Lol I know, I was just pulling your chain ;)
chain-puller! *shakes fist* :P :P
Taz wrote:I want one, not the right time though.*sulk*
no worries, there will be other litters in the future and, one day, when the timing is right... ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:55 pm

Unfortunately, the Nanook X Vega litter did not work out (Vega did not get pregnant)...

However, the Ninja X Zora litter was a BIG success as Zora gave birth to 10 puppies (5 females and 5 males)!
So far I think most of the pups are spoken for, though I believe we may have a couple of pups still available... I will just have to check with everyone on my waiting list first. ;)

Click here for photos: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 3916303618
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:39 pm

Congratulations :D

are there any pups staying in Croatia in co-ownership? :)

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:43 pm

Thank you! :D :D
Balto wrote:are there any pups staying in Croatia in co-ownership? :)
Yes, one female and one male (we just don't know which pups yet, until they are a bit older and we can properly evaluate them).
The female is already reserved but we still have to assign the male, or see if we will keep him ourselves.... ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Valravn » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:45 pm

Congratulations! This litter is really dark. Could just be the photos, but a few of them even look black!

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Wed Mar 26, 2014 6:23 pm

Sylvaen wrote:Thank you! :D :D
Balto wrote:are there any pups staying in Croatia in co-ownership? :)
Yes, one female and one male (we just don't know which pups yet, until they are a bit older and we can properly evaluate them).
The female is already reserved but we still have to assign the male, or see if we will keep him ourselves.... ;)
that is so great :D
female will be in Zagreb?

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Tana » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:36 pm

Congrats! :)

Can't wait to see how they turn out...

Have male and female with white shoulder, nose piebald coat?

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:58 pm

Valravn wrote:This litter is really dark. Could just be the photos, but a few of them even look black!
Yeah, the 3 dark pups look very black, for now, but I expect they will fade to wolf grey (agouti) as they mature.
Arya: Sylvaen Four-Leaf Clover also started out very dark / black, but she faded to a lighter wolf grey as she got older. ;)

As far as this litter's coat color genes....

Zora = aw/at = Zora is heterozygous for aw allele (agouti) and at allele (tan). In this case, we believe "at" (tan) is actually "a" (recessive black) - the MyDogDNA Pass simply cannot determine "a" at the moment, so all "a" (recessive black) dogs are listed as "at" for now.

Ninja = aw/aw = Ninja is homozygous for aw allele (agouti).

aw (agouti) is dominant, so all the pups should be agouti (aw/aw) though some could also carry recessive black, via Zora, and so they will be agouti (aw) carrying recessive black (a) = aw/a (like Zora). Though, for now, the "a" will show up as "at" on their MyDogDNA Passes; until Genoscoper adds a separate category for recessive black (a) to their locus panel.
Balto wrote:that is so great :D
female will be in Zagreb?
Yes and, for now, the male too... :)
For future litters we will definitely consider co-ownership in other parts of Croatia that are located further away, but we might limit the radius to 100km or so as it is difficult to organize matings with co-owned dogs over a long distance (for instance, having to drive for 6-7 hours to get to a co-owned stud dog in Dubrovnik would be a bit of a nightmare...). ;)
Tana wrote:Have male and female with white shoulder, nose piebald coat?
They have white spotting (http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/white.htm) which, I think, predominantly comes from Zora's side of the family tree if you look at the markings of some of Zora's siblings (but this exists in almost all Tamaskan bloodlines already).

viewtopic.php?f=34&t=1086
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=2493
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Taz » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:52 pm

Congrats.
I'm currently trying to objectively evaluate which breed of dog I'm going for next, and all of these new tamaskan puppies are testing my impartiality.
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Balto » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:05 am

Sylvaen wrote: For future litters we will definitely consider co-ownership in other parts of Croatia that are located further away, but we might limit the radius to 100km or so as it is difficult to organize matings with co-owned dogs over a long distance (for instance, having to drive for 6-7 hours to get to a co-owned stud dog in Dubrovnik would be a bit of a nightmare...). ;)
we are definitely further than 100km, but only 2 hours drive from Zagreb :mrgreen:
just for a record :D

can´t wait to meet all the Tamaskans that are now in Zagreb, and can´t wait to see them in harness with Klub sportskih i zaprežnih pasa :)

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Wolfsbane » Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:16 am

Sylvaen wrote:
Tana wrote:Have male and female with white shoulder, nose piebald coat?
They have white spotting (http://www.doggenetics.co.uk/white.htm) which, I think, predominantly comes from Zora's side of the family tree if you look at the markings of some of Zora's siblings (but this exists in almost all Tamaskan bloodlines already).

viewtopic.php?f=34&t=1086
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=2493
Ninja his half-sister:
normal_urlaub_und_dahldorf_131.JPG
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:02 am

Balto wrote:we are definitely further than 100km, but only 2 hours drive from Zagreb :mrgreen:
just for a record :D
Will definitely keep it in mind! :D
Balto wrote:can´t wait to meet all the Tamaskans that are now in Zagreb, and can´t wait to see them in harness with Klub sportskih i zaprežnih pasa :)
Yeah! let me know when you're next in Zagreb and we'll meet up for sure this time. :)
Wolfsbane wrote:Ninja his half-sister:
Yep, but not his full sister. I also look absolutely nothing like my own half-sister. ;)
Since neither Ninja nor Zora have been tested for S locus genes, it's hard to say if they are both carriers or if just one of them is... would be nice if it was included in the MyDogDNA Pass as part of the coat color panel test.
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Miran » Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:34 am

No litter all pups are perfect , especially with an outcross.
The pups are still so tiny and young that you can say nothing.
If even one or 2 will turn out perfect and some others good and some maybe not for breeding than still the litter will be a good one .

Congrats :)

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:11 am

Thanks Miran, that is certainly true. :)
Another good thing about having such a large litter is that it gives a good statistical overview to see what is produced... if there had only been a couple of pups that turned out either really great OR really bad, you wouldn't know if it was just a random fluke or a true representation of the genes they carry. With 10 pups, and only 1 'mismarked' with a white shoulder, we can say with more certainty that the probability for producing mismarked pups from this combination is low. I am very excited to see how the pups turn out... I think it will be difficult to decide which ones we will keep on co-ownership, at least until they are quite a bit older, but at least there is a good selection to choose from. One large dark male has already caught my eye, but we will see how they develop. :D
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Wolfsbane » Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:06 am

Sylvaen wrote:
Wolfsbane wrote:Ninja his half-sister:
Yep, but not his full sister. I also look absolutely nothing like my own half-sister. ;)
I didn't say that ;)
I was responding to your comment that the white spotting on some of the pups comes most likely from Zora's side... Seeing as Ninja has piebald haf-siblings (no not a full sibling but as you know piebald is most likely a recessive trait in the Northern/Wolf Look-alike breeds.. so Ninja his dad would be a carrier, which means Ninja himself would have 50% chance of carrying it), it might also come from his side or a combination of both.

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:46 pm

Wolfsbane wrote:I was responding to your comment that the white spotting on some of the pups comes most likely from Zora's side... Seeing as Ninja has piebald haf-siblings (no not a full sibling but as you know piebald is most likely a recessive trait in the Northern/Wolf Look-alike breeds.. so Ninja his dad would be a carrier, which means Ninja himself would have 50% chance of carrying it), it might also come from his side or a combination of both.
indeed :)
However, I think that if both Zora and Ninja carried it (Ssp x Ssp), statistically speaking we likely would have at least one (if not several) true piebald pups in the litter (spsp), such as with Takari's litter(s) instead of just 1/10 pups with a white shoulder patch... more likely, one parent carries it (Ssp). Upon further thought, I think that maybe Zora carries 'residual white' (as seen on some of her siblings) while Ninja carries white spotting, but unless they are tested for the S locus we will not know for sure.
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Hawthorne » Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:33 pm

Hi Debby!
I have been running around like a madwoman driving Freyja here and there and everywhere. This is the first chance I've had to congratulate you! Congrats on the puppies!!!! <3 :D

And I will just add: "there is no such thing as a perfect dog" :mrgreen:
Arrow has a curly tail. So I'm sure we'll see some of that come through.
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Miran » Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:58 am

Sylvaen wrote:Thanks Miran, that is certainly true. :)
Another good thing about having such a large litter is that it gives a good statistical overview to see what is produced... if there had only been a couple of pups that turned out either really great OR really bad, you wouldn't know if it was just a random fluke or a true representation of the genes they carry. With 10 pups, and only 1 'mismarked' with a white shoulder, we can say with more certainty that the probability for producing mismarked pups from this combination is low. I am very excited to see how the pups turn out... I think it will be difficult to decide which ones we will keep on co-ownership, at least until they are quite a bit older, but at least there is a good selection to choose from. One large dark male has already caught my eye, but we will see how they develop. :D
hahaha my eye also did catch that dark one :mrgreen:

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Valravn » Sat Mar 29, 2014 10:16 pm

Oh I love the green collar pup!!! <3

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:02 am

That's the boy I think we will keep. :D
He's massive, definitely the largest pup by quite a significant amount... and he has the cutest howl!!
I am so curious to see if he'll have bright yellow eyes; technically, they all should. :)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Katlin » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:03 am

I'm a fan of the lavender color girl <3 and the green boy too!
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:16 am

Purple collar girl is also one we have earmarked as a keeper. ;)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Valravn » Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:25 pm

Sylvaen wrote:That's the boy I think we will keep. :D
He's massive, definitely the largest pup by quite a significant amount... and he has the cutest howl!!
I am so curious to see if he'll have bright yellow eyes; technically, they all should. :)
I hope you do! I really want to see him develop! :mrgreen:

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by HiTenshi16 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:50 pm

Will any of these pups go to breeding homes in the US?
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:50 pm

HiTenshi16 wrote:Will any of these pups go to breeding homes in the US?
Yes, I think so... we're just in the process of working out all the details / arrangements. :)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by HiTenshi16 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:44 pm

I do hope so, this side of the pond could benefit from this line :)
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:53 pm

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

Post by Tana » Wed Jul 02, 2014 3:27 pm

I'm wondering why Ninja (and his litter with Zora) isn't listed on the TDR website anymore... Puppies are TDR registered, right? As well as Ninja? Just curious.

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

Post by AZDehlin » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:03 pm

Tana wrote:I'm wondering why Ninja (and his litter with Zora) isn't listed on the TDR website... Puppies are TDR registered, right? As well as Ninja? Just curious.
Ninja hasn't been DNA Profiled through Neogen yet, so he and his pups are not registered yet.

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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

Post by Katlin » Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:08 pm

Why hasn't that been done? Shouldn't it have been taken care of before the litter?
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Re: Upcoming Sylvaen Litters (SPRING 2014)

Post by Sylvaen » Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:59 pm

I am not certain if Ninja X Zora's litter was ever listed on the TDR website, so I can't say if it has been unlisted... but I can say that the litter will be registered with the TDR. I already have their TDR registration numbers and will be getting their certificates shortly. I am still awaiting some DNA profiles from the laboratory (each puppy and both parents have been DNA profiled with ISAG and AKC markers)... so it is easier for me to keep track of everything if I submit it all together rather than separately.
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